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Im sorry but, I hate apple fanboys.

The other day i was in a store with an apple fanboy, and without thinking twice he said his IMAC would kick my phenom ii 955, try way sli 260GTX and my seagate barracuda 7200.12 raid lol.

Now for me personally, I already have a couple of PMPs to watch movies on and listen to music, a couple of computers to work and browse the internet and my Blackberry gives me internet access when I'm away from my computers. So if I get a MID, I can't justify spending close to a thousand dollars on it. So I'm never going to be interested in an Ipad unless I get it dirt cheap off the internet.

For me, I'd probably be interested in a Android tablet around $175-$275 that offers enough features that I don't already get from my PMPs and Blackberry. For example, I'm really getting interested in the Ebook Reader Android Apps and the possibility of using Bluetooth headset to listen to music when I'm traveling. So this makes me more of the target consumer for a Chinese PMP than a "mainstream" PMP like an Ipad.

Chinese devices have fundamentally always had 1 major issue holding them back. Software.

Many a decent piece of hardware from chinese brands has been ruined by a lack of attention to detail or expertise when it comes to coding firmware. Most of the companies often lack the expertise or just rush product to market to get a fast buck without taking the necessary care and attention that say a large well known brand would. It's not only a lack of R&D budget but also a different strategy when it comes to marketing and selling these devices. Lets not forget as well these products are not made for foreign markets.

Not to say that all chinese hardware is good, there is a lot of rubbish chinese hardware too, and as mentioned it is absolutely imperative to have knowledge of the brands and a clear understanding of what you require and whether the devices you are looking at can do what you want them to. Stabbing in the dark can often lead to disappointment.

Nevertheless it is pretty remarkable how far these companies have come over the last few years, the quality of the product, attention to deal and software has improved greatly. I remember buying my first Chinese device a fair few years back now, it was a hacha rockchip based 26XX series device. Compared to what is available now it's obviously appalling.

I think the lower pricing is definitely a major factor for people purchasing chinese devices. But at the same time with the explosion of android and a continued growth in expertise and attention to detail these devices are becoming just as user friendly as many big brand players. But again as mentioned before knowledge is key, because it is so easy to get a turkey.

The main factors i feel still holding these players back is a lack of processing power, particularly for android based devices and the age old issue of firmware optimization across all of them. I also think power management is a big factor because many of these devices are still not replicating the kinds of battery times you would expect from the bigger brand devices. Would also be nice to see more capacitive displays and multi touch displays.

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Audio: Samsung YP-Q2
Video/Web: On the lookout for an Android Tablet
Blog: http://themonesthere.blogspot.com (Relaunch Soon, with any luck)

Thanks for the responses, to all who have contributed.

I pretty much agree with almost everything that has been said, with the exception of the poster(s) who equate iPad buying with some kind of terrible sin. I've said before that I've never bought an Apple product yet, but the notion that a newbie could pick up, in my case, the SmartQ v7 and hope to operate it correctly is just not true.

I just don't envisage Apple, or Samsung, or Archos etc, marketing units that require the end-user to upgrade firmware and make all manner of adjustments, just to have them work correctly in the first place. Is this an unreasonable facet to ask of a Chinese PM Player?

I fully understand and respect that the models I am referring to are made for the Chinese market - that's not the problem (as I see it) - it's the awful bugs and unfinished touches that makes it so.

I'm giving the MIDnite a try next but if that fails I'll just stick to something like the Archos new range of tablets, or hopefully the Samsung, if it becomes a reasonable price at any stage.

Seriously, take a look at what you need to do as a SmartQ owner, just to have the thing work - it's unbelievable. Partitioning SDHC cards and adding all manner of code and firmware fixes, plus the obligatory '....hold button x for 3 seconds, then depress button y for another 12 seconds while standing on one leg and reciting the alphabet backwards.....' It makes me feel queasy just thinking about it!

The above is not just a simple case of lack of R & D - it's clearly more a system that should be sold to knowledgeable folk who intend making their own code and bits and pieces, not to someone who just wants to switch on a device and be able to surf the internet, do a bit of work on and watch some videos and listen to some music, and maybe play some games and apps.

To those who are able to work around and implement the fixes and patches etc, I see these PMP's as being a fantastic product. To the less-skilled market, I am not nearly as sure.

Well my 1st iPhone 3GS broke after 2 week of moderate use, so software wise they might be better (by might, I mean everything as bugs, sometimes very big ones...) but on hardware side, they aren't the best, but at the same time, I understand what you mean about R&D, but you got to look at the fact that companys like Apple, Samsung, etc. etc, are big companys, even Archos is pretty big, but they haven't got the best rep when it comes to customer service

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PVP: Ainol V6000HDT 8GB
Music: Sansa Clip+
Tablet: iPad 3G
IEM: Brainwavz M3/ M1
Phone: LG Optimus 2X
Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost. That is alchemy's first law of Equivalent Exchange. In those days, we really believed that to be the world's one, and only, truth. - FMA

I understand your frustration w/ Chinese MIDs right now. If it wasn't for English language forums like this for me to turn to, I wouldn't chance it myself. It sounds like you should get an Ipad. Apple is supporting their product and you'll be happy w/ the features they offer on it. Thanks for your interest and I hope you're able to make that step in the future.

i think apple,archos,cowon make great products,but if all i have to spend is 100 dollars or so ,and can get a pmp that sounds good and plays all kinds of video formats and has a nice size screen and free shipping,that pretty much ends the comparisons for me,i have not jumped on the mid bandwagon yet,but a place like this would be the best place to get one,because they will help you if you have problems,those others places,most of them just sell you the stuff,and thats it,your on your own

I agree, and I think that the community here and the MP4nation shop itself are great assets. I'm really pleased with the help the support staff have provided and gladly/happily recommend this site to others.

The difference between the typcial PMP and a tablet is sizeable though. As a very basic example, I also bought the Ainol v6000hdt here and had no problems whatsoever in applying a firmware upgrade (thanks mainly to the superb step-by-step guide written by The Warrior Poet). However, the tablet I tried was considerably different and so much more difficult to work with, and I truly didn't even understand what the firmware/upgrade threads were instructing.

I do know that even the Sonys and Apples of the world will release buggy software, but you can guarantee that a fix is produced in a fashion of simply downloading a file and executing it, rather than having the user setting up multiple partitions and formatting memory cards in a specific type just to get started.

To TroyNation - I appreciate your continued advice. As the MIDnite is ordered I'll give it a try and if it proves the same I'll offer it on here or via eBay or something and just forget it. I don't really want to get the iPad though - I'm hoping the Samsung Galaxy or the new Archos tablets will be good enough to go with instead. It's not a 'fanboy' thing or anything like that, but I just don't like how Apple (and iTunes) tried to force me to buy an iPod just to listen to music I had legitimately bought from them (this is a different issue from simply authorising a certain player to accept content from iTunes, btw) so I'll avoid their products for as long as I am able to!

Loved your input here, Ted.

Did you ever get the MIDnite, were you satisfied?

Just interested as you have voiced some concerns that I share...

- Chi

for me it's not really about the price, and i suspect it's the same for many others too when it really comes down to it.
the thing is, if you were to buy a galaxy or an ipad you'd probably be happy for a number of years. the manufacturer support, bug fixes, updates etc keep it useful for a long time. but i see a lot of people here who jump from device to device in a short space of time and probably end up spending more than they would have done on a mainstream device in the long run. many reasons for this, but a few of the negative reasons for it are about what i mentioned earlier - manufacturer support. chinese stuff is constantly being made redundant by new models, updates and bug fixes are not common place and it's easy to feel as though your machine has been surpassed by something better in just a few months of buying it.

for me, the lure of cheaper chinese devices is partly down to the adventure of not quite knowing what you're going to get. it almost goes without saying that you wont get something as polished and well made as if you bought a mainstream device, but on the flip side you get something much more unique and possibly something that'll involve some tinkering on your behalf to make it work as you want it to (which is nice if you're that way inclined). god knows the amount of money i've (and i'm loathe to say it) wasted on gadgets that i could have consolidated into one fully functioning and more polished mainstream deivce, but that's not really exciting in my eyes. basically, i have a mild addiction to this non-sensical and vast library of electronics that are churned out of china on a seemingly daily basis, and i take great enjoyment in reading about their good and bad sides and then possibly grabbing one for myself, regardless of whether i already have something capable of performing the same tasks on another device. you might say i have more money than sense, but really i don't... i just can't stay away

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Music ---> Meizu M6TS 4GB, Fiio E5, Audio Technica ATH M50, Fiio S9.
Other ---> Window N50DT, HP Touchpad, HTC Desire, Dingoo A320, Gemei A330, OpenPandora.